Tea Partiers: Sore Losers

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Thu, 04/15/2010 - 05:48 — Joel

From today's New York Times' poll on the Tea Party movement:

They do not want a third party and say they usually or almost always vote Republican. The percentage holding a favorable opinion of former President George W. Bush, at 57 percent, almost exactly matches the percentage in the general public that holds an unfavorable view of him.

When talking about the Tea Party movement, the largest number of respondents said that the movement’s goal should be reducing the size of government, more than cutting the budget deficit or lowering taxes.

But in follow-up interviews, Tea Party supporters said they did not want to cut Medicare or Social Security — the biggest domestic programs, suggesting instead a focus on “waste.”

There are undoubtedly many sincere small government conservatives among the Tea Partiers. But it appears that many hate Big Gubmint, except when it benefits them. And the fact that the majority still love George W. Bush -- he of the Medicare drug benefit, the original bank bailout and the early stages of the car company bailout -- suggests that (for the movement as a whole) what really makes them mad are not violations of principle, but the fact that a Democrat is president.

Sore losers.

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Thu, 04/15/2010 - 05:54 — Joel

And...

It's absolutely their right to hate that a Democrat is president. I just don't think the movement should be seen as particularly principled. It's about power.

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 06:22 — crywalt

More on That Poll

Salon has a piece up about the Tea Party and that NYT poll. I don't generally put a lot of stock in polls, but I do like the results of this one.

The 18 percent of the nation that identifies with the Tea Party movement tends to be white, male, older than 45 and Republican.

Hey, it's Jim and Ben!

And also hypocritical: despite their anti-spending rhetoric, Tea Party supporters told pollsters that two of the federal government’s most money-consuming programs, Social Security and Medicare, are worth the cost to taxpayers....

Although, hang on, Social Security and Medicare cost more than the Pentagon? I don't think so. Maybe "defense" doesn't qualify as a program but it sure consumes money.

And half of them think the Obama administration’s policies favor the poor.

Which is hilarious, since almost nothing the federal government does benefits the poor.

Also, Salon reports that taxes have gone down, not up in the last year while tax revenues have gone up and the deficit has gone down. I really want to hear what the local Tea Partiers think about that.

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 08:29 — RobbL

Re: Pentagon vs. Entitlements

Although, hang on, Social Security and Medicare cost more than the Pentagon? I don't think so. Maybe "defense" doesn't qualify as a program but it sure consumes money.

Much more. Social Security alone is bigger than Defense.

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 07:10 — Khabalox

Tea Party Infiltrators

I was considering making a forum post to ask this question, but this seems like an apt place to put it.

Jim/Zaius/jlakely and deregulator have been tweeting about liberal activists planning to crash Tea Party rallies this week. The concern is that these activists are planning to hold up signs claiming to be racist, bigoted birthers, and thus cast a bad light upon the Tea Party at large. There seems to be a concerted effort to fight this - including making a sign for true TPers to hold up when they spot one of these iconoclasts.

But this begs an important question: If the Tea Party does not want to be seen as racist, bigoted or imbecilic, are they going to attack those of their own movement that really do hold these views with the same vigor as they do these character assassins? I completely understand the consternation at the proposed counter-protest. I think trying to slur the name of anyone is reprehensible, and in this particular case not at all necessary. But if the Tea Party is going to be honest with the country and themselves, then they need to address those within their movement who hold these outlandish views.

Oh yeah, and they need to decide if they are for big Government or against it. I can forgive a person for being an idiot, but being a hypocrite is pretty far down there.

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 07:28 — crywalt

No Racists

I suspect the Tea Party Apologists would claim there are very few true Tea Partiers who are racists, thus they don't need to root them out, only the liberals posing as Tea Party racists. I personally can't imagine anyone who has so little to do they'd show up to impersonate a racist Tea Partier just to discredit them; it sounds to me like the Tea Party Apologists are trying to explain those hoofbeats you heard by postulating a herd of people in zebra costumes. But I freely admit I don't know anything about anything.

As far as forgiving people for hypocrisy, I have to forgive them, because I'm a hypocrite myself so darned often.

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 07:48 — Khabalox

RE No Racists

it sounds to me like the Tea Party Apologists are trying to explain those hoofbeats you heard by postulating a herd of people in zebra costumes.

Well, I know anyone can register a domain and slap together a website, but I don't think they are being completely paranoid.

As far as forgiving people for hypocrisy, I have to forgive them, because I'm a hypocrite myself so darned often.

Is it be hypocritical for a hypocrite to forgive someone their hypocrisy?

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 07:59 — crywalt

Dirty Tricks

The trouble with dirty tricks is this: How do you know the fake Tea Partiers aren't fake fake Tea Partiers, planted by the Tea Party people to discredit anyone who tries to discredit them? This is a rabbit hole without a bottom, well known to anyone who reads Robert Anton Wilson or Timothy Leary.

Thu, 04/15/2010 - 08:39 — RobbL

Re: Hypocrisy

I've probably typed this here before, but Penn Jillette says he likes hypocrites because it's twice as likely that he's going to agree with them - he'll either agree with what they say, or with what they do.

Fri, 04/16/2010 - 08:15 — crywalt

Re: Hypocrisy

My standard routine is to say, "Have I ever said I wasn't a hypocrite? And would it matter if I had?"

Fri, 04/16/2010 - 06:11 — TotoMovies

History is being made

For as long as I've lived I've never seen conservatives march/picket/protest with such intensity and passion. And they had several Democratic presidents to do so over.

They're doing so now ... and it's no accident. We've never had a president like Obama.

The fact that the Left and the Media ... or do I repeat myself ... has done all it can to belittle this movement speaks volumes.

Fri, 04/16/2010 - 12:48 — Wry Mouth

I Can Has Prezdent Lik Obama Nao?

Careful, Mr. Toto; when you say

"We've never had a president like Obama"

Many people are going to reflexively think you are referring to the whole race thing.

You know. Instead of the whole "he seems like he wants to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs" thing.

Fri, 04/16/2010 - 15:24 — Deregulator

That's the dilemma Obama poses to his allies and his detractors

Those who criticize the substance of Obama's policies can always be portrayed as racists by rabid partisans or sloppy thinkers. My fear is that, if the final three years of Obama's term resembles Carter's more than Clinton's (in other words, if Obama doesn't pivot to the center, or proves to be as incompetent as Carter -- or GWB on domestic policy, for that matter), then he'll actually set race relations in reverse, as it will become nearly impossible for critics and supporters to carry on civil discourse that isn't poisoned by racial overtones.

I hope my pessimism is unwarranted.

Fri, 04/16/2010 - 16:16 — crywalt